Re: ELO > Is it better to quit a game if you are stuck with 2 AI's after players have left?



  • I stayed to finish the game but I still lost points even though I won the game??
    @administrators @Developers



  • @Nyte_ Somewhere the developers have said that when players leave and AI replaces them, the AI will retain the Elo, for computing your Elo change only.

    Also Elo is a person's last name, not an acronym.


  • administrators

    @Nyte_ If you, as the last human player, stayed in the game you should have gained Elo as if you had won, regardless of the actual position you finished the game.



  • @ Stannis B ....thanks for that...makes no sense to play the game out then



  • @Administrator Nope that's not what happened...maybe I am wrong???



  • This post is deleted!


  • @Administrator said:

    @Nyte_ If you, as the last human player, stayed in the game you should have gained Elo as if you had won, regardless of the actual position you finished the game.

    As previously mentioned >> nope this is not what happened. I wonder if there is a day that you can return unfair loss of ELO?


  • administrators

    @Nyte_ As mentioned many times before we can´t "give Elo back". It's just not possible without affecting other accounts that maybe aren´t even involved in a game where Elo was possibly deducted wrongly.

    Also, this would cause an unmanageable amount of support inquiries because lots and lots of players would ask to for a change of their Elo.

    Regarding the issue you mentioned. Are you 100% certain that this is not only a visual issue?



  • You could easily make a system that recalculates every persons elo based on the order of matches played. You just don't have enough developers to do it. Boardgamearena seems to have it figured out. I am actually working on a personal project that would solve that issue and it does not seem very hard. You just have to set some rules on how far back you allow the elo to be affected when changes are made in the past.


  • administrators

    @Stroom The system is not the issue per se but the way other players might get affected by an Elo modification.

    Let´s say you are an avid user playing 4 ranked matches per day in 3 player games. And you want a change for the first game you played that day. This means that at least 8 scores have to be changed based on your wish to change it. But it's "only" 8 if all your opponents only played one game that day with you.
    Given the fact that the average player plays 2 games per day, those 8 players have affected probably another 16 players.

    If you imagine the same case with 4 player games you end up at 36.

    You can easily see the cascading effect here. But that wouldn´t even be that bad.

    The real problem is the "unfair" part. Building a waterproof system that can detect involuntary connection losses or teamplay by opponents or anything else people might think of for a reason for an unfair Elo loss.



  • What's so unfair about this? The players who gain more or less elo than they should have based on some other player having invalid elo is already unfair. The cascading recalculation is not really a big deal. Even over 10000 games, if you run the recalculation once a day, it is not a big deal for a computer. You can write it into your terms that elo is not always precise and will be recalculated once a day. And the personal elo might change +-16 but it will affect others only by +-2 per cancelled game.

    Also, the fact that so many people complain about your servers kicking players out due to disconnection issues should make you reconsider how your system handles (or doesn't handle) these situations.

    But overall, elo is not a suitable metric for a game that has 4 players, player interaction (3 players can easily block someone to lose 100% of the time) and the randomness of the dice (all players at 9 points and someone gets the lucky roll) and the placement in the end does not matter (losing longest road and knights on the last turn would easily make you go from 2nd place to 4th).



  • @Stroom yeah I totally agree with that. 👍

    "When you don't know what you should do, look to the stars, they will always shine for you."

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  • @Administrator No it is not a visual issue


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