Escaping player

  • Hi, I have a problem with a player who is always escaping when sth goes the way he doesn't want, eg. sb stole from him, block his resource, put the city/road when he was planning to. I want to play but I can't, every game I start is with this player and he is escaping all the time. Because of it I have two questions:

    1. Is there any punishment for such behaviour? (eg. losing ELO, losing karma)
    2. Can I block this player that he won't be placed in the same game as I?

    I'd be grateful for helping me with this problem.

  • The game is too unstable to implement a punishment system at the moment. If a game crashes, the player whose turn it was, will get a penalty.

    This bad experience is going to drive players away from online Catan. If only we had an alternative to play on until the development is ready...

  • administrators

    @mar89 We are curretly working on block/mute and report options. Quitting the game prematurely will lower your karma rank. We are currently also evalutaing possibilites to punish such behavior in regards of th ELO ranks or login penalties.

  • Why force someone to continue to play, while he/she knows there is no chance to win anymore? This is ok when playing on a table, there is social contact, you can laugh with it. By internet this is very boring.

  • Are you serious? You should always play to the end. This is just a part of being polite to other players. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Otherwise you would see players leaving on the last turn before the obvious winner could make the game ending play. If people did it to you, it would take away all the good emotions of winning the game. This will enforce toxic community. You are still playing with real people. If you play with only AI do whatever you want.

    Board games are meant to be played from beginning to the end. Quitting is NOT a part of the game. "Don't be a dick." is one of the main guidelines to playing board games both online and offline.

    The game should not let you start another game until the last game is over. I don't know if this game works like that or not but it should. Quitting a game and starting another one should not be acceptable unless everyone agrees.

  • @Evarist

    If you don't finish the game, they lose their ELO points. Without a system to track wins properly (ELO points), this game doesn't have much of a future. if you want this place to be here in the future, finish your games. It's such a petty thing to quit. It's like we have a society filled with immature children.

  • @daedalic Not everyone thinks and feels the same. If you have bad hexes, 3 points and the winner has 7, you know that you will loose. Why must you be forced to continue, seeing someone win that you don't know? This is booooring. Let this unlucky player take his loss, (loose ELO) and let the game switch to AI.
    Once i saw a player leave his pc: all next moves were very, very slow, clearly done by AI each time 'time was over'. That's no fun at all for the ones remaining.
    As you play with 3 or 4 players, the others can continue.

  • @Evarist But when you quit, all the remaining players lose their chance at ELO points and the game no longer matters. That doesn't make for a sustainable gaming platform.

  • @Evarist said:

    If you have bad hexes, 3 points and the winner has 7, you know that you will loose. Why must you be forced to continue, seeing someone win that you don't know?

    Because it is a polite thing to do. Bad hexes is our own fault. Someone blocked you? Get over it and finish the game. It is more boring to end all games playing vs AI.

  • @Evarist Your arguments are fine if you are playing single-player against a computer, but playing against humans requires that extra degree of courtesy - if you have committed to a game with someone, then you should finish it.

    I frequently play on a lunch break, and there is nothing worse than spending most of your break invested in a game, only to have a selfish player bail on it. That usually triggers other players to leave, and you are left on your own without time to start a new one. Also, players with better etiquette who do play on never get to earn ELO, because as soon as there is even just one AI, no ELO is awarded.

    I think if you play live against other players, you need to accept that basic level of courtesy and play to the end.

  • @BlueMythril What i mean: this is an anonymous internet game. As long as you don't lose ELO by it, you will always have quitters. In stead of of complaining about this bad behavior, why don't you accept it? In chess and other games giving up is a normal thing. In our case you should lose ELO and the others can continue. For me this game is no fun anymore. I constantly worry: will one of the competitors quit just before i (eventually) win? There are to many of them.

  • Chess is a 2 player game. Quitting there is better because the other player immediately wins. Quitting in Catan where you have 2-3 players is not OK. The other players still have to make the moves for someone to win the game. Maybe 2 players out of 4 are very close to winning and the game is still intense. If you leave, that really ruins the fun of victory. And it might even change how the game ends because of how the substitute/AI makes your moves.

    Also, I have seen a lot of comebacks, people with 4 points catching up to the people with 8-9 points. Why give up early? Fight until the end. You don't become the best player when you quit the games when they become too tough to handle. You fight through that s...tuff!

    So what if you are in a bad/unwinnable situation? Either you made bad initial placements or the dice did not like you or the other guys blocked you so you could not win... Take it like a man and finish the game. The current leaver system is broken and it should be fixed to prevent leaving the games.

    The fact that you do not care about the other players and only about yourself means that you should not play online against other humans. (Sorry)

    1. it's not me who quits. I am a victim like most people here. What interests me is a workable solution to keep everyone pleased.
    2. <<The fact that you do not care about the other players and only about yourself means that you should not play online against other humans. (Sorry)>> Aren't you too much fixed on the card game? On internet the only thing you know about most opponents is their avatar. I think you shouldn't play on internet. I do care about avatars.

  • For sure, the quitter problem is out of control. It's insulting to nicer players and creating bad will for the quitters themselves. I'm keeping a list, and will take full advantage of the block/ignore function when it becomes available.

    When enough of us block them, the quitters will be stuck just playing with their own kind. When they tire of that, maybe they can make new accounts and not be so selfish. Or they can just play in their pool of negativity.

    Making them wait until their abandoned game ends before they can start a new game is very fitting!

  • I played 3 games tonight, in which all players quit before the end of the game when something happened they didn't like.

    In the 1st 3-player game, one player lost his city, and he left the game. That caused the 2nd player to also leave the game.

    In the 2nd 3-player game, a player got cut off, and he left the game. Again, that caused the 2nd player to also leave the game.

    In the last game I played, was at 9 points in CaK, I got a metropolis and laid down the a Road Building progress card to take the longest road, which would have given me 4 additional points for the win. As soon as I laid down the Road Building card, but before I was awarded the win, a player left the game.

    Completely frustrating to play an entire game and not get any ELO points. I totally agree with @Stroom who said "the game should not let you start another game until the last game is over." I'd continue to play with the bots just to prevent the quitter from starting a new game. Really, how hard would it be to program that in to discourage quitters? If the quitter went to start a new game, the system could see that they were replaced by a bot, and until that game finishes, the could not start a new one. Unfortunately, even this is not a full-proof solution as persons may just create several accounts to bypass being locked out. Maybe looking at the IP address instead of the username could help here.

    It seems that quitters are probably trying to "always win" to increase their ELO, but once they know they will lose, they quit. It is very frustrating to try to build up your own ELO points to continually have someone quit. At some point, it's not worth playing if this continually happens. There needs to be some sort or more severe punishment to quitters than what exists now.

    I agree with previous comments that if you play, you should be committed to finish the game even if it doesn't look like things are going your way. I have done that in all the games I have lost not only out of courtesy, but because an experienced Catan player always fights to the end! I've played plenty of games (in person) where someone seems like they are going to run away with the game, or are about to win, and through good game play and strategy, and use of the robber and penalizing progress cards, other players can hold back the leader so that the game is more even. So all I can say is that the quitters must not have these skills or determination.

  • Quitting is a very bad problem. 8 times in a row last night people quit. Two times near end of game. There are so many scenario's for quitting that it will take many rules to deal with it. Quitting rules can be passed by just disconnecting from site!!
    My ideas:

    AI should replace disconnected player when their turn arises, until they come back, may return at any time during game. Can not play elsewhere till that game ends, and the AI is released from their avatar. ELO should not be effected if game played for a certain time period for remaining players. No punishment for remaining players to quit while AI present.

    Disconnections should add up, till a certain amount is reached, then they can only play single player. To many players playing with poor connections causes many delays and game ends. Also this will punish deliberate disconnects.

    Honor to not quit means nothing to most, so punishment by lack of access is the only way. Points and such mean little to quitters.

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